Public comment is now open for a change the Department of Education is proposing to its list of “professional degrees.” Some of the graduate degrees they want to remove include architecture, social work, physical therapy and nursing. The removal of nursing, in particular, has led to outcry.
Kathleen Burke has a Bachelor’s degree in Nursing from Penn State and a PhD in Nursing from the University of Pennsylvania. She’s worked in a critical care unit, taught graduate Nursing courses, and been a hospital administrator. Burke is currently editor-in-chief of the Journal for Nurses in Professional Development.
She talked with WPSU’s Emily Reddy about why she opposes recategorizing nursing.
Here's their conversation:
Emily Reddy:
Kathleen Burke, thanks for talking with us.
Kathleen Burke:
Oh, thank you for inviting me.
Emily Reddy:
So one of the main impacts, if nursing is no longer on the Department of Education's list of professional degrees, is that anyone pursuing a graduate degree in nursing can't borrow as much in federal student loans. It's cut to about half as much $20,500 a year and $100,000 in total. What do you expect the effect of that to be here in Pennsylvania?
Kathleen Burke:
Yeah, well, I'm gravely concerned about the impact of reducing the federal loans for post-baccalaureate nurses, for several reasons. One, obviously, less nurses will be able to afford to attend school post baccalaureate. Most nurses still work as they're attending school. It's different than physicians that are paid to do residencies. Nurses are not. So by reducing the amount of federal funding, it will reduce the ability of many nurses to pursue postgraduate education. In addition, nurses when they go to a nurse practitioner program, it goes three semesters, so that's why it totals a lot more money than the new implications are allowing for. So nurses will have to seek funding from other agencies, private loans which will cost more money and many of them will not pursue. And at a time when we're in a healthcare crisis where the complexity of care is increasing and nurses are currently leaving the workforce, this is not the time to challenge and make it harder for nurses to have advanced degrees.
Emily Reddy:
This is for only graduate degrees in nursing. So who are these nurses? What nursing roles might someone who gets a master's or PhD be going into?
Kathleen Burke:
Wonderful question. I'm sure many people are not familiar with it. So a nurse can get an advanced degree as a nurse practitioner who has an independent license to see patients. They also can get a degree as a nurse anesthetist, which provides a lot of care for a patient, particularly in the rural areas. Because there is a shortage of anesthesiologists. A nurse can get a master's degree in healthcare leadership, where we need leadership in the healthcare settings. So and a master's degree in education, where we need more educators and faculty, because if we don't have more nurses, we're also going to have less faculty. And if we don't have enough faculty, we can't educate the nurses that we need to educate.
Emily Reddy:
The Department of Education has a fact sheet that says 95% of nurses, nursing students borrow below the cap, and that the cap might actually push down the cost of a nursing degree. What are your thoughts on that? Is it possible that Penn or Penn State might reduce the cost of graduate nursing degree because of this?
Kathleen Burke:
I'm not familiar with that statistic. And when they say nursing students, are they talking about undergraduate students or graduate students? Because the tuition is different. I don't see that happening because the cost of education is a challenge right now. I don't think universities can afford to do that. They have to pay for the clinical practice areas where nurses get their clinical experience. Nor are we going to pay faculty less than faculty already are paid less. I just don't think universities can afford to do that.
Emily Reddy:
The Department of Education says this isn't a value judgment on nursing or any of these professions. But I wonder, as a nurse, you know, how does that make you feel having nursing no longer seen as a professional degree?
Kathleen Burke:
Yeah, that concerns me. Because what will the public think? That you can't get a loan because you're not professional? I think the long-term implications we've yet to recognize and I'm concerned about them.
Emily Reddy:
Kathleen Burke, thanks for talking with us.
Kathleen Burke:
Oh you're welcome. Thank you, Emily.
Public comment on the Department of Education’s proposed change to its list of “professional degrees” is open until March 2.
